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"Crack the SEGA Saturn copy protection" contest

Mr. Saturn - Feb 26, 2005

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ExCyber

Mar 14, 2005

Or does the Saturn support audio effects in the CD player? In such a case I would imagine that the audio data would be fed directly into the audio DSP rather than routed through the SH-2s.

I was thinking of the 68000 more than the SH-2s, but I suppose there is a possibility that it is confined within the SCSP. I'd have to re-read various manuals to be more certain, but I'd be surprised if there's no way to get at the data. Still, I agree with you that using audio data is probably not the best way.

antime

Mar 14, 2005

Originally posted by retro+Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 07:49 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(retro @ Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 07:49 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>The Saturn dev manual says that you need the VCD card, yes. That would be the VIRTUAL CD card, not the video CD card.[/b]

The manuals very clearly state that the video output can be routed directly to VDP2's external input screen or read through the CD interface. Similarly the audio can be sent directly to the SCSP DSP or read through the CD interface (the same applies to CD-DA).

<!--QuoteBegin-Mask of Destiny@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 09:04 PM

From what I understand (and Imay be mistaken, I don't have a Saturn), under normal situations the SH-1 resets it's internal CD authentication status whenever the CD door is opened so in order to successfully do a disc swap one must trick the Saturn into thinking the door was never opened. This boot CD seems to get around that somehow.[/quote]

AFAIK, the CD block doesn't reset unless asked to. The boot CDs main purpose is to prevent the Saturn from returning to the CD player when the tray is opened, which will cause a re-validation of the inserted disc.

Mask of Destiny

Mar 14, 2005

Originally posted by antime@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 06:59 PM

AFAIK, the CD block doesn't reset unless asked to. The boot CDs main purpose is to prevent the Saturn from returning to the CD player when the tray is opened, which will cause a re-validation of the inserted disc.

So I take it that the CD player resets the CD block then. Any guess as to why it would do this? Is resetting the CD block necessary to get the controller to reread the TOC?

Borisz

Mar 14, 2005

Originally posted by retro@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 11:49 AM

ARGH! NO NO NO!

The Saturn dev manual says that you need the VCD card, yes. That would be the VIRTUAL CD card, not the video CD card. It is an ISA card that goes in a PC and emulates the CD drive, basically what the Mirage does.

[post=131506]Quoted post[/post]

I wasn't talking about copy protection, I was talking about what effects does the video cd card enable.

mal

Mar 14, 2005

Originally posted by Piratero@Tue, 2005-03-15 @ 05:40 AM

btw, there is a copy floating around the forums. make some good use of the search feature. :slap

I've even linked to it in this thread.

Quakester2000

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by mal@Tue, 2005-03-15 @ 12:09 AM

I've even linked to it in this thread.

[post=131538]Quoted post[/post]

But thats KD02 not KD01. I thought KD02 was for 3rd party games where as KD01 was for 1st party games no one has attached that.

Anway as pointed out could it be the saturn only validates Mode 1 cdroms? It is possible to burn a data disc in Mode 2 (Not recommended for long term use as no error correction) Though it would be interesting to see what happens though some older devices might see the mode 2 disc as Audio so recommend to turn off tv volume if you try.

retro

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by Borisz@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 05:19 PM

I wasn't talking about copy protection, I was talking about what effects does the video cd card enable.

[post=131531]Quoted post[/post]

Go read what I said again.

The dev manual references the VCD card. Unless it SPECIFICALLY says Video CD card, it means the JVC Virtual CD ISA card. This was later superseded by the Cross Products Mirage, which is an external version.

The port on the Sophia, Cross and (modded) Psygnosis saturns that is labelled VCD is where the Mirage (or card) goes. It stands for Virtual CD, not Video CD. It is for CD drive emulation.

mal

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by Quakester2000@Tue, 2005-03-15 @ 11:03 AM

But thats KD02 not KD01. I thought KD02 was for 3rd party games where as KD01 was for 1st party games no one has attached that.

My bad.

AFAIK the KD01 has never been posted at SX. It may be around on some FTPs but I haven't frequented them in years.

HI_Ricky

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by Mask of Destiny@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 02:35 PM

So I take it that the CD player resets the CD block then. Any guess as to why it would do this? Is resetting the CD block necessary to get the controller to reread the TOC?

[post=131523]Quoted post[/post]

1. put in cd close door.

2. read toc (no sega ip info=4b,with sega info=3)

3. read sega ring (yes= 4a,no=4b)

4a.show you all track and cd player icon auto change saturn icon

4b.show you all track and cd player icon

		croft	Mar 15, 2005
		Hi All, Thanks for posts. The 2 saturn blanks that i have are genuine and brand new. They are still selaed and have never been opened. You can see the security ring from the back and they havent ben touched at all. They are 100% mint and air sealed. You could make a boot cd from one of them. Out of curiosoity if i was to sell 1 how much $? Hope this helps, Thansk, Ian.

Borisz

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by retro@Mon, 2005-03-14 @ 07:35 PM

Go read what I said again.

The dev manual references the VCD card. Unless it SPECIFICALLY says Video CD card, it means the JVC Virtual CD ISA card. This was later superseded by the Cross Products Mirage, which is an external version.

The port on the Sophia, Cross and (modded) Psygnosis saturns that is labelled VCD is where the Mirage (or card) goes. It stands for Virtual CD, not Video CD. It is for CD drive emulation.

[post=131549]Quoted post[/post]

Yes, I got that. so?

dj898

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by croft@Tue, 2005-03-15 @ 09:16 PM

Hi All,

Thanks for posts.

The 2 saturn blanks that i have are genuine and brand new.

They are still selaed and have never been opened.

You can see the security ring from the back and they havent ben touched at all.

They are 100% mint and air sealed.

You could make a boot cd from one of them.

Out of curiosoity if i was to sell 1 how much $?

Hope this helps,

Thansk,

Ian.

[post=131601]Quoted post[/post]

around $50 mark I believe...

		retro	Mar 15, 2005
		Nah, they're only $20 sealed on YJ, if that. Mr Saturn was right, BTW - copying the boot CD is pointless. You still have to use the swap trick, only now you're adding an extra bit to the equation. You don't gain anything. Yes, it allows you to insert a CD. Still, you could have just done the swap trick to do the same thing, quicker. Unless you have an original boot CD, you still need to do the swap trick on the boot CD copy!

Drenholm

Mar 15, 2005

Originally posted by croft@Tue, 2005-03-15 @ 10:16 AM

Out of curiosoity if i was to sell 1 how much $?[post=131601]Quoted post[/post]

Couldn't tell you, I'm afraid, but I'd like to get my hands on some Saturn blanks myself. It's my guess that you're not selling them, right?

I'd like to buy one or both, if you were, but at the moment I don't have the funds.

		croft	Mar 15, 2005
		HI Retro, Once done the blanks would make a fully usable bbot cd. No disk swpaping would then be neccesary. Just insert the disk and hey presto - play what you like untill the machine is turned off. By the way where did you say the blanks are available please? I was looking at testing the water so to speek with the ones i have. Cheers, Ian.

		retro	Mar 16, 2005
		I wasn't talking about the blanks. I meant it is pointless everyone wanting an ISO of the boot CD. It seems noone is able to grasp that simple premise, though - good luck getting this project completed!! They turn up on Yahoo Japan. As a Saturn collector, I think it is sad that something there are so few of would be used, but then again, it is yours to do with it as you will. Once you burn to it, it is worthless, though - and don't forget there was only 1 writer that was approved by Sega. Good luck finding that, too.

		dj898	Mar 16, 2005
		probably easier to find System Disc 2 or 1... I really don't see the point of cracking the copy protection. to run the home brew titles? But what titles? it will more than likely used to produce HQ fake copy of expensive titles... p.s. retro mentioned YJ. Yes Dev Saturn pops up there from time to time and one of my CartDev Rev.B I got off YJ for only 1800 yen... it wasn't complete missing AC adaptor and documents but at least it came with System Disc 2 inside so I was able to recoup more than enough on that one alone... he he

mal

Mar 16, 2005

Originally posted by dj898+Wed, 2005-03-16 @ 11:32 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dj898 @ Wed, 2005-03-16 @ 11:32 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>it will more than likely used to produce HQ fake copy of expensive titles...

[/b]

I doubt it would be a problem.

You'd have to put a hell of a lot of time and effort into producing high quality fakes to fool collectors and I don't reckon the market would be big enough to warrant the investment.

That's assuming that the protection is broken in a "disc only" manner. If you needed to use a cart as well, forget it.

btw, I think that anyone who mentions Saturn CDRs or System discs is forgetting the original premise of this thread:

<!--QuoteBegin-Mr Saturn

So iÂ´m about to start a "Crack the SEGA Saturn copy protection" contest, giving the winner a price of letÂ´s say 200$ (Dollars) or 150â¬ (Euros)...

Winner is, whoÂ´ll find a way to bypass the copy protection with a boot cd or by cheating the Saturn or something else, which outcome of this is, that gamers can play copies by just inserting the CD-R in the Saturn CD-RoM without having to install a modchip or without to apply the swap trick....[/quote]

Can we please stick to the topic at hand? We're looking for a method that anyone can use, not one of the lucky few that posess system discs or Saturn CDRs. If you want to talk about Saturn CDRs and system discs find another thread.

		croft	Mar 16, 2005
		HI Retro, Thanks for the good info. Much apreshiated. I can burn the boot disk onto any cdr. The recorder in pc does many speeds including 4X. So the burn process shouldnt be a problem. Thanks for the post.

		mal	Mar 16, 2005
		Someone can't read... Unless you're discussing a method that "anybody" can use, please don't post here. [edit] no dj898 - we're not talking about any method available. System discs and Saturn CDRs are not available to everybody. Please STFU.

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