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Ghost in the Shell
Curtis - Oct 11, 2002

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  Curtis Nov 22, 2002
What I find interesting abouth this...ahem..informed and reasoned debate is the fact that FAKK is comparing DVDs to LDs. This is like comparing apples to oranges, really.

LD is an analogue format. Yep, that's right - LD has more in common with vinyl than any of the newer digital technologies.

Shouldn't you be arguing with antime?

 FAKK2 Nov 24, 2002
yup I like the Analogue picture over the digital picture. Most films look better in Analogue format and the Majority of film Directors agree that LD picture is better looking than DVD picture as the picture overall looks Normal on LD. and Yup Im a bigger LD fan than anything else, oh and try to get more movies on DVD, a friend of mine has more than 5 movies on dvd he has got to get up and change...disc 1 to disc 2....big deal....dvds look/sound shitty case closed. Alot of people talk about the positive sides of LDs and DVDs, try comparing the negatives and youll find there are more negative aspects to dvd than lvd.

 grimey Nov 24, 2002
Ok heres my opinion on ld , and fakk2 you know I love laserdisc so dont take it the wrong way .

Heres where I base my opinion , I have 120 laserdisc and 80 dvds .

Laserdisc +

1.More available movies (specially clasics , try to get indiana jones on dvd or the first star wars movies are not to be released untill 2005 or somthing .)

2.There cool because you don't see them everyday .

3.No digital blocks .

4. More durable (have no idea how companies are going to make a profit renting dvds , they get ruined so easy)

5. Right now you can get the typical ld on ebay for an average price of $3

6. more when i can think of them .

Dvd +

1.Typically better video and sound quality .(depends on the quality of transfer job on ld , alot of the 80's movies they did a pisspoor job . Few movies like fifth element may possibly be better on ld .)

2. More features , laserdisc can have any feature dvds does but typically has much less of them .

3. Way cheaper , typical dvd cost $20 , laserdisc prices ranged from $40-150 new ($150 being for box sets and inn the middle range for criterion .

4. Smaller size , Im very space consious and dvd take up little space , espially compared to vhs , in fact you could hundreds of dvds in a binder the space of 1'x1' .

5.Better avaibilty , kmart , walgreens , taget carries dvd's back in the day only elite stores and a few rental places carried ld's movies , today I live in a huge city and theres only one store that has a decent selection .

6. Don't suffer from ld rot , not that ive seen yet at least .

You do have to flip some dvd's it depends on how many layers they want to use and length of the film and what kind of final quality they want achieved . Think I have 6 dvds you have to flip goodfellas and seven are two that jump to mind .

Also ive notice that the newer dvds players play smoother , id say its just as important as the making process of the dvd .

 FAKK2 Nov 24, 2002
hahaha yep, true true, but DVD and LD rot happens, its caused by leaving it on paused screens for too long making the laser sit in one area burning the LD or DVD, just dont leave it on pause and walk away, or fall asleep. Its also caused by dropping the LDs or bending them making the glue start to come apart. Its funny you mention Star Wars movies.....you know the reason lucas will not release them on DVD yet, come on, dont say I need to thump your skull with the cold hard truth again...hehe DVDs. yuck!! Now Blue Light Laser DVDs are going to be nicer thats for sure, 2X-4X the space on one side of a DVD giving you much more space so they dont need to compact the shit outta the video and all these everyday dvds that have been out for a mere 4 years now will be thrown in the trash can and forgotten about, I mean hell DVDs right now are ONLY Suped up Video CDs!! Thank god for Pioneer and thier brilliant workers!! They knew how nasty dvds normally look so BLDVDs are coming very soon *hopefully*. And will mean the death to all these everyday crap ass dvds making Blue Light the Norm. and that wont be so bad, still compressed junk, but until then...DVDs blow goats, and that is the reason I will trade the DVDs for your LDs anyday of the week. That Block Noise bugs the shit outta me, it ruined my Robotech box sets, I swear to god, my VHS tapes look cleaner....Go figure....

 FAKK2 Nov 24, 2002
And Curtis, the ONLY thing Analogue about LDs is the Picture/Video, and it looks DAMN GOOD!!

 grimey Nov 24, 2002
Actually ive heard ld rot happens from the glue coming loose from the middle of the plastic and the part where the binary is written to , letting in air and moisture thus degrading total overall quality , ive only seen this in one or two movies I have but can be commonplace in early 80's disc

I found this on a websight :

WHAT IS LASER ROT? I THOUGHT LASERDISCS LASTED FOREVER...

Last updated: 04-Aug-94

Here is a general description of LD rot:

When a laserdisc is manufactured, it's actually two sides which

are glued together. The final product is two sheets of aluminum

sealed in a plastic enclosure.

Sometimes, a bad manufacturing run will also seal in some

impurities next to the aluminum; usually in the form of an air

pocket. The impurities will react with the aluminum and produce

aluminum oxide. The effect is that areas of the LD will be

discolored.

A laserdisc relies on the fact that laser light will reflect off

of the aluminum surface. A contaminated area would not reflect

the laser beam as well. The usual result is a video dropout

(i.e. a dark line across the picture). If a wide enough area is

contaminated, then video and/or audio is completely lost.

Unfortunately, once the rot starts, it won't stop until the supply

of impurities is used up. Victims of rotted discs can look forward to

having the disc get worse and worse until there's no more reactive

material left. If the plastic seal has been broken, then outside air

will provide an unlimited supply of impurities.

Note that Compact Discs (CDs) are also suseptible to rot. The

manufacturing process is simpler, so occurances of this are much

rarer.

 FAKK2 Nov 24, 2002
hmmm yes its true, this is how LD rot occours, I bought some extremely cheap LDs on eBay and they had rot. it figures... but DVD rot happens as well....

 grimey Nov 24, 2002
You cant tell by looking at the disc with the naked eye , believe me youll know that a disc has rot by its playback quality , lines that run in the screen , little rondom square white dots appearing here and there ect .

 FAKK2 Nov 24, 2002
I can see laser rot on an LD with my eyes, if held to a certain light the silver tin looks bumpy as hell compared to a normal LD with no rot.

 googlefest1 Nov 25, 2002

  
	
	

		
		

			Originally posted by FAKK2@Nov. 21 2002, 7:02 pm



oh well, I try to tell you the difference between good stuff and crap, but nobody cares, its just like the old days, people went with VHS over Beta, why....Not because VHS had good pic quality, no they chose VHS over Beta because VHS is cheaper shit!! Thats the only reason we got stuck with CRAP!! Is because people are cheap dicks!! And now my LDs are going to be obsolete, why? Not because DVD is better, but for the same reason as VHS, its cheaper junk and people will not spend thier money for anything worthwhile anymore, its allways cheap ass garbage that becomes the Norm. SHIT!!



If people would get off thier asses and buy the expensive stuff, we wouldnt be stuck with CRAP for years and years on end!! People say shit like Titan AE on LD for $55 bucks? or Titan AE on DVD for $15 bucks, hmmmm...Ill go with the DVD...grrr, you chaep damned people make me sick!! Now I understand that not everyone can afford LDs, but damn man why support something nasty looking like DVD you might as well go support VHS as well, they both suck ass. Now because of Cheap ass people Im going to be stuck having to buy cheapo dvds for the next 20 years!! And pretend Im getting some kind of enjoyment out of them, when all Ill actually be doing is looking at all the block noise and rainbow artifacts on the screen saying shit like, Wow, its a little better than SVCDs...


i agree with you here -- i think thats one of the reasons sega died -- because people didnt want to pay more for better stuff -- i personlay think if you cant afford it right away wait alittle save up and get the better product - but most peoples mentality is not like that - they want that urge to buy something to be satisfied -- other than that i have no argument about LD and dvd i never had an LD but always wanted one -- and i also notice the screw-ups in dvd video

 FAKK2 Nov 25, 2002
googlefest is correct, that is the main reason sega died. If people would have just bought the more expensive sega stuff instead of the cheaper stuff, Sega would still be alive and doing very well nowadays making us great games on thier OWN units, but again the cheaper stuff became the norm, and sega is now pretty much dead.

 gameboy900 Nov 25, 2002
Sega stuff expensive?

WTF are you guys on?

Genesis stuff was either lower or at the same price as SNES. The SCD was the same when compared to other CD systems of the time. There's really nothing you can compare the 32x too. Saturn while the system may have cost more, the games were at the same prices. And finally DC, good god the system and games were ALOT cheaper than any of the current consoles out. Can anyone remember BRAND NEW Capcom games coming out at $20? Cheaper does not always win, image helps ALOT.

But yes price does matter for alot of people, believe it or not, not everyone is a rich fuck like you FAKK2. Some people actually have to be careful what they buy. There are people who are lucky if they can afford to buy one dvd a month and still pay the bills.

 FAKK2 Nov 25, 2002
actually I hate to disagree with you time after time, but compared to TG16 and Snes the only expensive thing back then were SNK Neo-Geo and the Sega CD, $200 for the system and $300 for the cd player was $500 bucks plus tax! costs a shitload more than the $199.99 Duo and the $149.99 Snes....believe me sega was expensive the PSX was ONLY $200 bucks, but Sega Saturn out here in CA was around $300 bucks the day it came out and way more in Japan before in hit the usa. Believe me, I know. I bought them ALL.

And Im not a Rich fucker, I hate to tell you this, I never have money, but I still buy the most expensive stuff I can find. Fuck dvds and the cheap pricks that buy them. If I was rich I would not have needed to wait till the year 2000 to buy my LaserActive videogame system. Just because I buy Nice Expensive things doesnt mean Im rich at all, it just means Ive got class!!

And if you are that poor to where you can barely afford 1 $5.00 dvd a month, I would tell you to just shoot yourself in the face, but you are probably to poor to even own a gun!

(yes, New DVDs at Target start at 5 measly bucks!, piss-poor VHS quality is the reason why they are soo cheap)

There is no point in arguing with me on this (LD vs DVD), I hate dvds soo much I got into a fist fight with my uncle over this and kicked his ass. DVDs are nothing more than a step backward in our technology, and it sucks.....I pray they die out soon and good stuff takes over...another fuckin era of crap videos...blah!!

 googlefest1 Nov 25, 2002
thats a messed up thing to say fakk2 some people realy have no money

but i disagree with the other point about the price thing

if you wait and save up (instead of being i want to buy something NOW!!!) and have a fund going then you can aford it (even if you have to sacrifice a monthly purchase [like that 1 dvd])

fakk2 is right about the prices i remember sega cd 300 $ 32x 250$ (i think) saturn 300$ -- i remember when the genesis first came out its was 300$ or close 2 it (where i was) then droped in a month to the average price wich was still high it wasnt untill a few years later that it droped again

if stack99 reads this he can help out with the memory here (same area as me )

 FAKK2 Nov 25, 2002
Hey man I really have NO MONEY, ask anyone who deals in trade with me, Im broke ALL the time!! But I still will not stoop as low as to buy a DVD unless Im forced to do it, like Pitch Black and Blair Witch 2 is ONLY on DVD so I was forced to get those, but if they ever come out on LD, just like the other 20 or so dvds I bought in the past, they will go out the door and in the trash can after I finish stomping on it and throwing it like a frisbee all over the street.

What can I say after 20 or so years of watching LDs, DVDs just dont thrill me like all the other people that had VHS all of those years, true, IF all you had is VHS then DVDs would be a truely great thing for you , but if you had been watching something better for 20 years and then all of the sudden they quit making the good quality stuff and forced you to watch something you know for a fact that is dirt cheap, piss poor quality , you would be pissed off as well man....thats all Im trying to say.... Im being FORCED to buy something worse in quality because people have had VHS for so long they dont really understand that LDs were out all of those years, and they were better. All people see is that DVDs are cheap,small, and nicer to have than VHS....truely dissapointing turn in events. People that love High Quality stuff gotta suffer now, because of all the "Cheapo" people.

 googlefest1 Nov 25, 2002
i agree and it sucks and we cant do anything about it except vent on places like this

 FAKK2 Nov 26, 2002
hehehe yeah, thank god for cool messageboards like this one.....whew, I feel alot better now. hehe

 Daniel Eriksson Dec 11, 2002
Interesting, finally a place do discuss Anime here on SegaXtreme, great thing! Oh, and i have to say, Ghost in the shell, Grave of the fireflies, Metropolis, Macross, Evangelion, Record of lodoss war, and some more Are my favorites. I can´t pick one though...

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