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PETA offers Hamburg, NY $15,000 to change its name
IceDigger - Apr 22, 2003

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  ExCyber Apr 24, 2003

  
	
	

		
		

			also, excyber, that link you posted is a satire. none of the information in there is accurate, because it's not supposed to be.


Here's the problem: none of the information is accurate, but it's really not far from the mark in terms of actually trying to find information, which is kind of the point of the piece. Satire exists for more than laughs.

edit: while I'm in the thread, are there any decent veg*an organizations that actually concentrate on promoting veg*anism instead of spending most of their time demonizing omnivorism?

 sizone Apr 24, 2003
aaron, you may be a horrible seller, but you're a great humanitarian. however humans were designed to eat meat (not anywhere near the amount the average american consumes) they were also designed to hunt that meat though. my favorite food and one of the few things i find myself capable of eating nowadays is steak. with every delicious bite though i think of the totally unnatural and downright unholly means that said morsel was brought to my mouth under. from the thousans of years of eugenics which have turned something resembling a gazelle into well cattle to the relatively recent trend in industrialized ranching practices which has turned that cattle into a walking piece of meat. i feel disgusted with myself, but then again i smoke and that's pretty horrible too. at least when i spark up the only thing i'm hurting is myslef. regardless of this constant nagging guilt i have no desire to give up eating meat. i guess it all comes down to the simple fact that i'm human. for want of a better phrase (as i'm totally areligious) god has givin me providence to do so. while i endulge in this providence i try not to abuse it. i don't think man has anything over the other beasts of the field except thumbs. being surrounded by the ignorant masses though i must say "when in rome". back to my earlier point of man being designed to eat meat. nothing tastes better or feels better to eat than fresh venison. we are by nature hunters. the lack of a conection between killing and meat removes not the appreciation, but the respect from the process. with a worlwide population of 6+ billion the concept of self-suffiency hunting and farming looses it's validiaty at least in the "developed" world. the simile i end up drawing is with the television programs in farenhiet 451, at some point the population becomes so vast that anything you air is going to offend so many people that you'd be better off not airing it at all, what you end up with is hours of programming full of sound and fury signifying nothing. to draw he corealtion on this jello of semi-cohherent ramblings, while i've always agreed with peta's aim's i've seldom agreed with their tactics

 gamefoo21 Apr 26, 2003
what i said about a plant screaming is true it screams an electro magnetic scream(just cuz you can't hear it doesn't mean its not there like a dog whistle) and this is the same plant treated differently by two ppl at the same time. this was on discovery channel and in a magazine.

 aaron Apr 28, 2003
excyber, try vegan outreach. http://www.veganoutreach.com... they're a little less preachy and a little more fact-based. which i really appreciate.

i guess that was my point, sizone, in that you're at least thinking about it. whether you choose to do something about it or not is your own decision, but i disagree with your statement that humans were meant to eat meat. to be brief, our digestive system merely adapts to eat meat. i've been vegan for a year now, vegetarian for longer than that, and just recently (at easter) my family thought it would be funny to tell me that the green beans were vegan and showed me the can and everything, yet they neglected to tell me that they had put them in beef broth. long story short, i got really, really sick within a few hours, point being that my body hasn't had beef for so long and wasn't able to digest it or the bacteria therein. this is not the case when you go for a long time without eating ANY vegetables (which you couldn't healthily do anyway, but that's just a given). and also, with our flat teeth, it'd be kind of hard to rip uncooked, newly-killed flesh from the bone, even with our twoso-called "fangs" that pale in comparison to any other animal forced to kill its own food. and yes, we have the ability to hunt and we are smart enough to do it, but i'm more vegan because of my protest of the way slaughterhouses operate (and their negative effects on the economy and the environment) than for any other reason.

but i agree with you about peta's tactics. sometimes i think they do more to hurt the cause than to help it. (like the ridiculous stunt that this thread was originally about)

gamefoo21: if you find me a source, then i'll put my foot in my mouth and say you were right. but it still won't change the fact that plants are not sentient beings and do not feel pain.

 Quadriflax Apr 28, 2003

  
	
	

		
		

			Originally posted by aaron@Apr 28, 2003 @ 11:46 AM



gamefoo21: if you find me a source, then i'll put my foot in my mouth and say you were right. but it still won't change the fact that plants are not sentient beings and do not feel pain.


http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/news/index....nstan...


  gameboy900 Apr 28, 2003

  
	
	

		
		

			Originally posted by aaron@Apr 28, 2003 @ 10:46 AM



 gamefoo21: if you find me a source, then i'll put my foot in my mouth and say you were right. but it still won't change the fact that plants are not sentient beings and do not feel pain.


Just because something cannot react or quickly express pain doesn't mean it doesn't feel it. Plants just take alot longer to reach to environmental changes than animals. And just how exactly can you say plant's aren't sentient beings...philosophers have been trying to figure this our for thousands of years and have yet to actually come up with a good solid definition of it. Plants are just slow animals in the end who can happen to make their own food. That's about as far as the diffrences between the two go. I mean heck how do you define algee, it can make it's own food but is single celled like other protozoa which we call animal..more or less. And hey there are plants that eat animals too. The whole animal/plant thing is really not as simple as people say or think it is.

And hey when I peel an apple I am basically skinning a (used to be) alive creature...how is that diffrent from what happens in a slaughter house when they skin a pig or cow? And please explain to me how you are supposed to kill an animal for food purposes and not see the things you had in those pictures.

And as for the whole teeth thing that is mostly a question of evolution. Over the many thousands of years humans have been around, our ability to use tools to cut and carve meat has made our "fangs" less necesary for survival than in the past. If you look at skulls of ancient humans you will find larger "fangs" on them. Also our closest cousins apes and such have much larger "fangs" than we do..mostly due to their lack of tool use.

 aaron Apr 29, 2003

  
	
	

		
		

			Originally posted by gameboy900+Apr 28, 2003 @ 09:43 PM-->
QUOTE(gameboy900 @ Apr 28, 2003 @ 09:43 PM)